Smoothing?

[ES.DEK]

I about done with my associates degree and all through out school I was told by many people that smoothing is bad for a 3D poliginal model. Basically my question is, is it alright to smooth a model that will potentially go into a game engine. Feel free to elaborate!

[Mrpearlzildjian]

If by smoothing, you mean actual smoothing/subdividing.. then no. High res models are usually only used for FMV sequences, not real time.

If I didn't get this right, please be more clear and I could give you a better answer..

[cookepuss]

I think that it's also important to note that the distinction between high poly & low poly is getting much blurrier. For one thing, consoles & PCs are getting powerful enough to handle poly counts that would have been impossible only 5 years ago. For another, a lot of companies are opting to do the cut scenes with in-game models, making for a smoother transition from video to gameplay.

Generally speaking, as Mrpearl said, you would want to avoid subdividing the model for real-time purposes. Currently game models have poly counts in the thousands. With subdivision, it's easy to get the poly count up into the millions. When using ZBrush to detail my models, I usually work in the 7mil-20mil poly range. However, for the sake of practicality, I eventually have to reduce that count to only several thousand.

In games, it's a balancing act. Speed VS Beauty. You can use very few polygons and achieve awesome render speed, but the models may look too boxy. ...OR... You can give lots and lots of polys to your models, but risk cripplingly slow framerates. Ideally, a game artist will want to find something in-between.

Another way to interpret the question might be, "Can I subdivide my already finished model?"

Well, that's tricky. For one thing, there's that speed VS beauty issue. For another, if your model is already triangulated then the subdivision will likely produce some ugly surface artifacts such as dimples, lumps, & weird bends. Subdivision & triangles don't play well together. More over, depending on where you do it, subdivision may disturb the boundaries of your carefully crafted UV set. As a rule of thumb, final = final. Subdividing a final product can lead to unexpected complications.

If the question has to do with edge smoothing (ie. smoothing groups)... it all depends on what the surface continuity is like. If you've got hard edges that need to look hard, by all means, break the shading along those edges. If you've got smooth, organic surface then you obviously don't want to break up their shading because you'll end up with something that looks faceted & angular.

[ES.DEK]

I love you both really. Thank you for the quick reply and the great answers! This makes me feel better because when I smooth they generally look crappy. Thanks again!

[ES.DEK]

just to reiterate, its alright if I smooth as long as I do it before starting the UV process and as long as I keep my poly count reasonable? Or am I completely wrong?

[ES.DEK]

on that note, I know its probably a stupid question, but should you tringulate a model before exporting it and putting it in a game engine or is that done automatically?

[ES.DEK]

Man im really sorry that im just racking up the questions but What should you go by when your watching the poly count...Verts, Edges, Faces, or Tris. (Im assuming its either faces or tris but I want to make sure!)

[Positivity]

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[Mrpearlzildjian]

just to reiterate, its alright if I smooth as long as I do it before starting the UV process and as long as I keep my poly count reasonable? Or am I completely wrong?
Reply With Quote

This depends on your work flow. If you are not going to retopologize your mesh, unwrap it in the low poly stage. It will be extremely difficult to unwrap a high poly mesh, due to the tedious selection of the faces/edges/etc. If you ARE retopologizing, you can smooth/sculpt/detail all you want, then retopo your mesh over the "smoothed" version, unwrap the retopo'd mesh, then project your "smoothed" or high poly mesh's details to the low poly mesh. Either way, you would ideally want to unwrap at a lower poly level.

on that note, I know its probably a stupid question, but should you tringulate a model before exporting it and putting it in a game engine or is that done automatically?

No such thing as a stupid question. You gotta learn somehow. In my experience, it is highly discouraged to triangulate a model before putting it into an engine, for a couple reasons... 1) Because the deformations will be really screwy if you decide to pose/rig it. Riggers will tell you all the time, they hate hate hate rigging triangulated models. 2) Simply put, the engine will calculate this for you. Mesh's are seen by the engine as triangles, but if you want proper deformation and general compatibility, quads are the standard usually. Plus the mesh will look a lot cleaner.

What should you go by when your watching the poly count...Verts, Edges, Faces, or Tris. (Im assuming its either faces or tris but I want to make sure!)

Like I said above, the engine will calculate by Tris. When you are looking at poly budgets for something, 99% of the time, it will be in Tris. A face consists of 2 Tris or less. Either way, it is all calculated in Tris, so stick to that.

[ES.DEK]

Thank you guys so much! This has been like the millionth time you have answered a question of mine Mrpearlzildjian and i really appreciate it!!!