BHG Challenge | Gavin | Leviathan

[Gavin]

BHG Challenge | Gavin | Leviathan
http://www.gameartisans.org/contests/competitions/uploaded_thubnails/29-game-3d-art-320-1176687080-bhg_thumb.gif

Gavin has entered the competition!

[FredH]

You are off to a great start man! With a concept like this, you will win hands down Lol

[Gavin]

Hah! I thought you'd appreciate that :P

Here is a slightly more serious one this time:
http://www.gavimage.com/bhg_comp/concept1.jpg

Some notes:

Obviously, I'm not very skilled in the concept department...just wanted a visual to start with. The idea is that this guy is a huge reptile, t-rex type creature. Mainly based in the water, he can come to the land hunting for food or when he just wants to cause some trouble.

Is face is going to be almost dinosaur like with a giant metal armor plating on his head and covering most of his spine. Going to have barnacles and rust covering most of the metal...just to give it some character :)

Thinking that his torso can be mostly flabby, doesn't need to be ripped muscles or anything. Have scales on his back, shoulders and scattered on his limbs and then have a soft belly. His hands and feet will be webbed to help him swim.

I'm having trouble with the legs though, as i want to do something a little more interesting than just shin bone. Maybe some kind of armor plating or scale formation?

I'm open to any suggestions you guys may have as this is just a rough sketch, hoping to dig deeper this week. I'm thinking about adding a bunch of metal plating to his right arm as well, just to throw it off a bit. Based on my DW2 entry (and some othe rpieces I've done) I think one of my problems is not being overly exciting with my colour scheme. Any suggestions in that department are more than welcome :)

Hmm...think that's about it. Can't wait to see this competition progess.

Thanks.
Gav

[onelung]

haha, got my intrest with the thumbnail for sure.
So your gonna bust out another, welp i can't wait to see this beast! As for the legs maybe if you develop your story of him a bit more, maybe he was held captive for centuries incased in obsidion, or used as a beast to destroy atlantis..

Thats the only way i ever get anythign somewhat more original. (since i too lack in the concept relm)

Other than that... um... stilts? Best of luck man.

[Marcus Dublin]

I really enjoyed your DOW2 entry and I’m eager to see what you do with your character for this comp!:)

Marcus

[kurocrash]

glad to see you're participating! looking nice once again!
are all the black bits going to be just barnacles or will there be some algae/sea scum? could be a nice touch. and some of those microbes have bioluminesce. though you did do the glow thing last time & i don't know if you want to go down that route. just some ideas, take them or leave them! as for the color scheme, i'd say match it to whatever sort of environment set up you have in mind. obviously water, but is it open sea water, pond/lake, polluted river, grotto, etc?
good luck, as if you need it! lol


-J

[Yung]

Go with the first one! The second concept is suboptimal :P

Glad to see you in this comp! Hope to see another great piece from you.

[Gavin]

Wow, thanks for the great response guys.

onelung: Stilts would be pretty slick. I like the idea of being an Atlantis destroyer, I'll have to think about that a little more.

Marcus Dublin: Cheers dude, same to you.

kurocrash: Thanks! I think the black bits are going to be a mixture of scales and just general, collected gunk. I'm thinking the environment is going to be somekind of marsh or beach area. I'd like to avoid spending time on trying to figure out water :P

Good point about the glowy bits, I think it'd be neat but I'm trying to avoid repeating what I did in dw2. Although having glowy coral on him or something is tempting. I was also toying with giving him a big plated gauntlet...but I think it's too similar to my last guy. So, I think he's just going to go with the Incredible Hulk forearms with a webbed claw, hehe.

Yung: It's tempting. Easiest character ever :P Thanks man.


Here's a little update, really just a scribble of something that I'm thinking. Maybe give him the dog type legs, some fins on his forearms (just for looks, I guess), thinking about scraping the idea of metal plates on his neck and back and making them more organic like a lobster shell, maybe some chains and ropes around his legs. I also added a lure ontop of his head, probably redundant, really, but I think it'd be neat as a "vulnerable area" if he were placed in some sort of adventure game.

Let me know what you think:
http://www.gavimage.com/bhg_comp/concept2.jpg

Maybe I should update that thumbnail? :D

Cheers,
Gav

[ChrRambow]

You should defenately stick with the first one in the thumbnail! ;)

Nah ... i like the way you mixed up serveral reptiles and fishes.

[Marcus Dublin]

Sometimes simplest direction is the best way to go, I like the basic design of the first image a well. Of coarse once you start modeling and sculpting you'll really flesh out the design I bet.:)

Marcus

[Gavin]

Hmm...maybe I should stick with the frist concept....:think:

Did another little sketch, this time showing his face and trading in plates for fins...I think I like this one more as it makes more sense. He looks less intimidating than I want in the final:

http://www.gavimage.com/bhg_comp/concept3.jpg


For those of you that don't know, I used to be a huge D&D geek and, half way through sketching this, I realized that I could probably use this as perfect reference:

http://www.warbozz.dk/Graphic/fantasy_adnd/githzerai_vs_death_slaad.jpg

Thanks for the feedback guys,
Gav

[Jido]

The new face works so much better, esp. with the lure. Great new colors as well. I do miss the fins on the forearms.

[Gavin]

Good call man, I think the forearm fins will make a triumphant return.

Thanks,
Gav

[Vikkie]

I laughed out loud when I saw your pictogram concept :)

I think you are off to a great start with your latest concepts.

best of luck.

[zann]

Hey the lastest thumb looks much more natural. I like the idea especially the head part. May the force b v u :thumb:

[Gavin]

Hah, thanks guys :)

Little bit of progress on this guy. Started modeling the head...sans lure and fins for now, but it will be added..trust me.

http://www.gavimage.com/bhg_comp/leviathan_01.jpg

Thanks,
Gav

[ChrRambow]

I like how he turned out ... good start on progress. :)

[kurocrash]

really digging the new color scheme with the grey! and already with the model? geez! i really need to get cracking on mine! anyway it looks to be off to a great start!

-J

[Marcus Dublin]

I love the new direction you took with this creature, as he feels even more organic. The model off to a cool start but the head seems a bit different than the cone shape reptilian feel of the sketch. Oh well we’ll have to wait and see how it comes together during the modeling process. Good luck with this guy as he looks like a lot of fun to work on!

Marcus

[kipiripi]

Yeah Gavin ,new direction better,Nice start,its looking clean and babyish :D

[Gavin]

Thanks guys, I really apprecaiste the feedback.

I did a little more work on him tonight while listening to the hockey game...it's going a little slow but I'm hoping to have most of the base done by tomorrow night and start the sculpting on Wed or Thurs.

Did some work on his body, added the lure and bigger parts of the fin. Also tweaked his face shape a little more...may have to do some more work to it.

http://www.gavimage.com/bhg_comp/leviathan_02.jpg

Let me know what you think!
Thanks again,

Gav

[ThatDon]

Loving those hands man!

[Marcus Dublin]

He’s looking really fierce, I love the sense of mass you have going on as well. Keep em coming!:)

Marcus

[kongni]

Oooooh! Now I can see where this is going. I really like the shapes you have so far. Keep it up! :)

[Gavin]

Thanks guys...a little more. Any suggestions? Thinking about moving onto sculpting here soon.

http://www.gavimage.com/bhg_comp/leviathan_03.jpg

Thanks again!
Gav

[kurocrash]

the only thing i'd comment on is that he's looking a wee bit shorter than in the concept art. don't know if it was intentional though.
i am digging the lower body a lot with it's proportion to the upper body. a suggestion? maybe kind of flattening the tail horizontally, maybe make it a bit longer, to kind of act as a rudder? that way he could cut through the water quicker if he leaves the shallows?
anyhow, it's looking great!

-J

[Frozan]

i have to say right now this is my favorite right next to thatdons! nice work buddy.

[KruddMan]

I'd agree with kurocrash. the concepts make him appear more lithe and mobile while the model seems much more stout and squat.

doesn't appear as he could attack a character at human scale because he can't bend over
if the tail was repositioned and scaled differently i think he'd appear to balance a lot better

[kipiripi]

its beatiful.You have super clean meshs ,Gavin. Sculpt,sculpt....

[Gavin]

kurocrash: Thanks buddy. I changed his relation to the human model a bit. I also changed the tail as you suggested. I think in the concepts he's a bit leaner but once I started modeling I wanted him to seem more heavy (stout I guess is the word...just not short...maybe bulky?) Even though it's not pictured here, the tail is longer than before and I have sculpted it to be slightly broader on top than before. Thanks again :)

Frozan: Thanks!

Kruddman: Thanks, I have changed the tail a bit to help balance him out.

kipiripi: Thanks ;)


Did some sculpting on this guy, hoping to get most of it done by tonight or tomorrow. The barnacles are kind of just place holder, I think most things like that will be added once I start texturing. This is a max viewport with the pieces imported from ZB. Obviously it's not as high as it can be in ZB so some things look chunky.

http://www.gavimage.com/bhg_comp/leviathan_04.jpg

Thanks again for the feedback guys,

Gav

[ThatDon]

#@*!ing awesome man!

[Frozan]

thats what im talking about!

[george.vas]

I like where you are going with this...

[Marcus Dublin]

Awesome stuff Gavin, my one small crit would be that his chest seems a bit overdone. I would have guessed that for a creature his size he would have more
Fat on his chest, the hard striations make him seem a bit small and he looses a bit of power. All in all impressive work, this makes me want to kick my stuff into high gear, hehe.:lucky:

Marcus

[ThatDon]

Hey Gav,

Just a small crit, you have a really cool boo boo/cut on his belly but it's working against you when trying to sell his proportions, I mean what in the hell did that kind of damage to this huge dude!

[Frozan]

hmm very true. the only mortal i could see doing that is well kratos. judging from the scale of that human next to him its possible but the fact that we are trying to make sense of it is a sign of maybe a revision.

[Gavin]

Hey hey guys, thanks for the feedback. good point about the chest, maybe I'll soften it up and make it more flabby looking?

For the cuts, especially the one on his stomach, I can reduce the size. I was thinking of what could possibly inflict a wound like that...I was thinking either maybe an anchor sticking into him or maybe a ship crashing into him. I guess that's rathe runlikely though, not a problem to tone it down a little. Maybe reduce that one but add a few other small knicks?

Thanks again!
Gav

[Wahlgren]

Heh. It would look pretty cool with a ship crashing into him.. :)

Anyway, Nice stuff. Would love to see some textures soon, Hint hint ;)

[Slythis]

looking gnarly man, can't wait to see textures

[kurocrash]

i saw the cut & thought anchor. or coral outcrop. or appendectomy, given where it's at lol
i did have a question though. the way the pecs kind of 'fold', was it just muscle mass or were you going for gills? because that's kind of how they strike me. seeing how big his neck muscles are, if he were to swim, the water would pass across the gills easier there. could just be talking out of my ass though lol
excellent sculpting though thus far!

-J

[george.vas]

Looked like gills to me too and I think that is a great idea...

[shadowbreeze]

man this is looking really good, looking forward to seeing some texturing

[Vikkie]

looking really good:D those forearms would make him squeeze rocks!

[Gavin]

Wow, thanks for the feedback guys. As for the chest, I never really intended for it to be gills...although it is an interesting idea.

A little update on this guy, did some work on his legs and fixed up the issue with his stomach cut and chest (although it's not pictured here because I forgot until just now)...A little more and I think I'll begin a low poly version.

http://www.gavimage.com/bhg_comp/leviathan_05.jpg

Thanks,
Gav

[FredH]

You really managed to give him a sea like look. The scare on the belly was a great addition man! If you have additional polies, it would be cool if you put on transparent planes everywhere for seaweed and maybe even a fishing net that he drags along while he comes out of the water.

[Gavin]

Thanks Fred!

The alpha planes are a great idea. I'm going to have one going down his spine for the spiny bits, but having multiple seaweed ones would be bad ass. I was thinking about having ropes wrapped around a part of his leg (which I'll add in PS)...might be cool to have sea weed attached to that.

Thanks again!
Gav

[Frozan]

heck yeah this is looking good!

[Gavin]

Thanks man :)

Here is an update. Low poly version weighing in at 4726, leaving enough room to add some alpha planes for seaweed and stuff.

http://www.gavimage.com/bhg_comp/leviathan_06.jpg

Thanks!
Gav

[h2olt]

Really nice work.
How'd you mannage to get a normal map that smooth from such a detailed model? looks real pro.

definately get some of that seaweed in there it would help to give it more of a sense of scale.

[Frozan]

nicely done!

[Socket7]

Your monster just rock! Nicely done. Although I'm worried a little about seaweed visibility on such huge pangolin. :) Nevermind, no crit from me actually. Very good work!

[Yung]

Wow! Two weeks away from this place and out comes this great model! Great job Gavin! The tail of the highpoly model seems to be get muddier towards the tail? Can't wait to see this textured.

[FredH]

Yeah, this is pretty awesome man. If Yung can't wait to see the tail.. I can't wait to see a new thumbnail:p Don't get me wrong, your initial thumbnail is priceless but.. well, don't make me come over there and hit you Lol

[Gavin]

Hm...slow progress from me. Thanks for all the feedback!

h2olt: Thanks! I use ZMapper to create my initial normal maps, usually takes a few tries to get the settings just right...but I can't be bothered to play with Max's projections :P

Frozan: Thanks.

Socket7: Yeah, I'm not exactly sure how I'm going to do that just yet. I was thinking about adding a rope wrapped around one leg and just having a few small planes hanging off of that. I could also have a few longer planes across the tail that has netting or a big chunk of seaweed that's got stuck to him. But you're right, because of his scale, visibility will be an issue.

Yung: Thanks. Yup, you're right....I think i got lazy. Although it's not pictured here I have changed it based off of your feedback. Rather than have the straight, blobby tail, it's now ribbed the whole way down. not as intense as his underbelly part...more so cracks with a few scars.

Fred: No need to hit me, I've finally changed my thumbnail :D

A little bit of progress, first pass on the head and body textures. It strays a bit away from the colours I initially planned on...but I just wasn't feeling it once I tried it on him. So I played around with it. Also, I was originally planning on having barnacles on his back but after thinking about the scale, I think each barnacle would work out to be the size of a human head. So, instead, I'm going to dot im with little glowing bumps, like the lure on his head. I guess it could pass as a fake school of fish to the unsuspecting victim.

http://www.gavimage.com/bhg_comp/leviathan_07.jpg

[onelung]

HAHA, hell yea! Dunno waht kinda shaders your using, but might be nice to try and get some lavander skin tones going on under the belly area. Normals look really nice.

[Merlyn]

Very cool, quite Clash of the Titans esq. Personally i would like to see more definition in the arms. Keep it up.

[kurocrash]

geez! he's really coming together now. Excellent work & i'm digging the blend of the countershading, between the back & the underbelly. and that speckled bit on his back (are you continuing that throughout?) reminds me of the shark in life aquatic. very nice work!

-J

[Yung]

Looking sweet there Gavin! Show us the new tail :D, Fred will be happy :D
No crits from me regarding textures (I sux), but better hurry up. The deadline is getting near.

[Gavin]

Thanks for the feedback guys!

Did a little more work on this guy and I think I'm on the home stretch. Besides a few more tweaks and maybe adding some netting or seaweed to him, I think Leviathan is near completion.

http://www.gavimage.com/bhg_comp/leviathan_08.jpg

Thanks again,
Gav

[ThatDon]

you rock gav, enough said :)

[Marcus Dublin]

Wow, I better get a move on!:ack: Awesome stuff Gav!:)

Marcus

[zann]

This is insane! Awesome works man :thumb:

[onelung]

Looks awesome, the clavicle/ upper peck seam is pretty disturbing. Shell speckel looks real nice.

[Gavin]

Thanks guys!

Not sure if I'm going to do the same one as in the conept or not, I'm toying with one now with a lower viewing angle...hoping to sell the sense of scale more. Not really sure how much further I want to push the textures, I'm open to any suggestions :) Untill then I think I'm going to start working on a base. It's hard to make something quick when the scale is this big...I was thinking about making seaweed on him...but it would need to be huge clumps of seaweed in order to make it out...we shall see.

Thanks again,
Gav

[Shinja]

wow impressive work gavin. Especially on the textures. I know you are trying to push detail to make the character have a sense of large scale, but dont over do it with detail. The simple the better as usual :) which you already know.

Also try adding or playing with a third color to experiment on, but i see it is a bit hard ... Just my 2 cents..

[george.vas]

Good stuff Gav... :thumb:

[ThatDon]

terrible work, you need to stop playing so much 360 and focus on getting better.

har har har!

[Antimagic]

Awesome work. Nothing much else to say except that.

[Nyx702]

This is really awesome, I have a question if you don't mind? What do you render out from? I really like the look of your renders. Anything special that you do?

[Gavin]

Thanks guys.

Nyx702: Nope, nothing too fancy usually just a few omni lights...usually go with a faint blue and orange. I'll be doing some lighting tests with the new time that has be alotted and will probably post them here but again, it's nothing crazy :)

If you're interested, I put a brief description of my lighting setup for my DW2 entry in the Making Of tutorial.


Gav

[Nyx702]

Ah, cool, I will check it out now. Thanks!

[Gavin]

Word.

Just been playing around a little with a base, background and lighting setup. The lighting setup now is more or less what I used on Thrull, I may keep playing with it.

I'm going with the idea that the area would be like a dried up land that used to be deep water. So, as the water started to evaporate, this creature started to venture onto the land.

I also toyed with adding a few patches of seaweed hanging off of him. Not really sold on it yet, let me know what you guys think.

http://www.gavimage.com/bhg_comp/leviathan_09.jpg

[Nyx702]

Ugh...there is a huge tangent in the pose! His arm blends right in with his tail!

I think the seaweed looks like tattered curtains compared next to the human. Maybe if they were more tapered? Or you could put some limp/dead seaweed on the base?

[Jido]

Darker and more stringy, the seaweed make it.

Anyway, after my time away, leviathan looks amazing regardless of the weed.

[ThatDon]

I don't think he posed yet? Anyways, lose the seaweed, and amazing job Gavin, you have a few more days to perfect this guy so use the to spank us all!

[Gavin]

Thanks guys, did a few tweaks based on your suggestions and other ones that I've heard. Trying out a different light setup..

He is posed, but it's pretty subtle...just to get him out of his default one...his a bit hunched forward, arms are looser, looking and down and his tail/legs are moved a bit...although it's nearly impossible to tell at this angle.

Dropped the seaweed for now, may reattempt it. I like the idea of it if he wasn't supposed to be as big as he is.

I didn't even notice the tail/hand problem, I've rendered at a different angle trying to make it better but I may just have to srop his tail down a bit more.

http://www.gavimage.com/bhg_comp/leviathan_10.jpg

Gav

[Socket7]

Amazing! It looks like he is made from stone, is he? At least his front part. And eyes are kinda blank. Maybe some iris or you will glow them?
Good job! And you have time to sell it perfectly.

[Marcus Dublin]

Class work, I'm curios to see what you have in store for the final shot, your pretty far along and I would guess you time to do something insane "no pressure":D hehe, nice going Gav!

Marcus

[Vikkie]

Awesome work Gavin! The model and the textures are amazing, I'd love to kick his butt. (in a game of course, I'd pass out if I was too see in real)

[Gavin]

Socket7: Thanks man. Nah, not neccessarily made of the earth...but very old.

Marcus: Thanks, heh. Not sure what I'm going to do for the final pose, I had this one ready for the original deadline and am not sure if I'm going to push it much further. To be honest, I'm kind of getting tired of him...looking forward to new projects :P

Vikkie: Cheers.

Did some playing around with colours and lights. The last image I showed off was a darker version of the older skin but after getting some feedback, I'm attempting to show more colour in him...I guess more towards what the original renders were rather than the blacker ones. Let me know what you think.

http://www.gavimage.com/bhg_comp/leviathan_11.jpg

Gav

[Chasarsis]

Truly stunning work =O
If you make another tutorial on this, I'd especially love to read how you hid your seams so well.

[FredH]

this is looking excellent gavin! The only thing I find a bit strange is the shiny gold like ground with huge cracks. Did you try a very flat and non shiny texture? I am not sure if it is your intention, but right now, the shiny ground is making everything look plastic and toyish. If this was your intention, it's working:) Additionally, the huge cracks is making your giant seem small and it's making the human look mouse sized. Perhaps if you lessened the cracks a bit, everything would pop back into their proper scale.

Everything else, awesome!thumb:

[EVIL]

the main thing that bothers me is the lack of shadow casted on the ground.. it all feels very flat atm, and I think a good maybe baked in shadow would be ideal to seperate him from the ground a bit so it would look like they are of diffrent materials, also make the ground less shiny and give it a darkerr brown color.. something less gold looking so it doesnt look to mutch like the skin on the giant..

[Gavin]

cheers guys.

Chasarsis- I'm intending on doing a tutorial and I've been waiting to see what people would like me to elaborate mor eon (since the workflow is mor eor less the same as thrull), I'll definitely cover this.

Fred, Evil: Thanks guys, I'll see what I can do about the ground over the next few days.

Thanks again.
Gav

[Nyx702]

Another tut would be awesome! Personally I would like to see some post texturing tips. Like texture gathering and when the model is ready to be textured? Also, a little more on building a base mesh that is optimal in Zbrush. I know you covered this a little in the other tut but particularly in the joints and hands I have problems.

Thanks man! This looks real nice!

[kurocrash]

damn that turned out nice! excellent work gav!

-J

[typhus22]

that is awesome dude! are u going to pose him looking down at the human or no?

[papabear3d]

wow!! great work!! :thumb:

can we see the wires and texture maps? tnx much :)

[Gavin]

Hey guys, thanks!

Nyx702: I'll see what I can do.

kurocrash: Word.

typhus22: I pretty much just left him in the original pose, was going to tweak it a little more but got side tracked with work and another project I'm cooking up :)

papabear3d: Yup.

Not much has really changed, but here are the final images. Probably won't take them further post-competition as, like mentioned before, I'm bored with it and moving onto other things:
http://www.gavimage.com/bhg_comp/BHG_Leviathan_Winning.jpg
http://www.gavimage.com/bhg_comp/BHG_Leviathan_Beauty.jpg
http://www.gavimage.com/bhg_comp/BHG_Leviathan_Texture.jpg
http://www.gavimage.com/bhg_comp/BHG_Leviathan_Construction.jpg
http://www.gavimage.com/bhg_comp/BHG_Leviathan_Concept.jpg

Thanks again for all your input guys, it's helped me a lot.
Gav

[Marcus Dublin]

This came out pretty dam awesome Gavin, nice going but I'm curious as to why you didn't use a bit of color on your spec map? Anyway this is a terrific design and a sweet piece that will go quite nicely on your portfolio!:lucky:

Marcus

[Gavin]

Yo Marcus!

Thanks man. I'm not overly sure why I kept the spec monochrome. I guess it's because at work we have to use the spec as an alpha of our normal maps. just habit I guess..In retrospect, I probably should have made it a little blue :P

Gav

[Antimagic]

It's great seeing another titan at the finish line. If all the entries were together in one shot, it would be really awe inspiring to see.

Really inspiring work Gavin:)

[ThatDon]

amazing work gav, nice to see you use that extra week and really polish this sucker, i'm sure it will pay off!

[zann]

These final images have been added to my game modeling pic library! Well done :thumb:

[warrior21]

wow, this one one badd ass entry, excellent work:)

[FredH]

Top Notch work as always!:thumb:

[Gavin]

Thanks guys :)

[ThatDon]

I just wanted to point out how awesome your wireframe is, that is some clean ass modeling man.

[Yung]

Bloody good model! Only crit would be the diffuse textures, where the muscles folds and scars occurs. Turns out a little brownish and grayish. Man, you are a great source of inspiration, Gavin.

[ThatDon]

I going to mug you for your mug......

congrats gav.

[gavku]

Congrats on the win dude....much deserved.

[Heber]

hey man,
you've come a long way recently in your work, really like your concepts/executions on your models congrats on winning too.
My only crit is in your texturing , you seem to bake too much ambient occlusion and lighting information into them but the texturing itself is getting better each time.
cheers

[Gavin]

Thanks guys.

Heber, thanks. Haven't talked to you in a long time, hope all is well with you and Propaganda. I totally agree about the lighting info, it's a bad habit I'm trying to ween myself off of. My next project will hopefully be a bit better in that regard.

Cheers,
Gav

[cdimax]

nice job!!! very good texturing!!!

[kotter]

heh, somebody's been diggin hard! :lucky:

[Neox]

yeah cdi, is it really needed to dig out threads from 2007?