Unearthly Challenge - August 2008

[FredH]

http://www.gameartisans.org/contests/events/4/images/prizes/prizes_main.jpg
http://www.gameartisans.org/forums/extras/UC_thread.jpg
Unearthly Challenge Has begun!
www.unearthlychallenge.com


Unearthly Challenge has officially started!

The rules in brief:
And so Begins the Unearthly Challenge... an annual epic event between the Worlds of GameArtisans (Good) vs the Worlds of Polycount(Evil)! In this challenge, there are no stories, no time periods, no styles, and no characters. There are only two rules: Choose Good or be Evil, and make your environment Unearthly! It can be extremely beautiful or hideous, Outrageously detailed or chaotic, Shockingly horrifying or divine, Utterly angelic or hellish, or even Tremendously jolly or depressing. Basically, it's your job to create something Extreme to impress the judges, our sponsors, and of course, your adoring fans - the public.

To read the complete rules. Go here now: http://www.gameartisans.org/contests/events/4/rules/index.php

To view prizes, go here:
http://www.gameartisans.org/contests/events/4/viewprizes/index.php

To switch to polycount colors, press on the green cut tab on the top banner of every UC page, or go here:
http://www.gameartisans.org/contests/events/4/viewprizes/index.php?lang=french

3D Participants, you must choose a concept from our wide selection of concepts to begin your entries:
http://www.gameartisans.org/contests/events/4/concepts/index.php

The system will be open for entries this weekend. So get your ideas ready!:thumb:

We are the good guys, and so are our lands. We must do all in our power to prevent the touch of green from touching our lands. Don't be surprised if I join the battle. Although I can't enter officially, I would still like to protect GA by being amongst its troops:D Good Luck to all those who enter. We are going to need it.



~

[Vassago]

Woohoo! :D

[AdamLee]

Awesome!!:2thumbs:

[Argon]

It's about time!!! Awesome! Hope it won't be late august, because it will be too close to school:s

[Rain]

Looking forward to seeing team play back into action. This looks really good Fred. Can't wait to see it start! My character inspiration folders are almost maxed out because of DWIII, but my Environment inspiration folders could always use some more love:D

[Rasmus Holmgren]

Cool stuff. Makes sense to have a separate contest for environment art as well, only great things can come of it, and it's a refreshingly different beast. Here's hoping the themes won't be as juvenile ;)

[kirilot]

well this is something new, sounds awesome

[Armanguy]

Awesome stuff im so stoked for this :D i can finally enter :)

[Trigon]

Nice! Can't wait to see some details on this one. 3 man teams will be sweet too....

:)

[Mattimusss]

This will be fun to see.

[sinz]

Was wondering when something like this would happen after reading numerous comments here and there you guys got your wish :) .

Can't wait to see the competition details & what everyone will come up with, (so curious)!

[TryForce]

i luv yoooo

[Taehoon]

Very interesting... Another big event is coming.~

[OrganizedChaos]

This is really awesome. The dominance war has been such a hit, I'm sure this will too. I like how it looks like teams will be encouraged for this as well. Not bad.

[Addi]

VERY excited :D
Can we sign up somewhere for email updates?

[FredH]

There will be only one gameartisans.org main comp before this. It will start in a week or two. Otherwise, glad you guys like this new event. It's going to be another unique idea. Environment comps are tricky, so I think I figured out a way to make this one very interesting:)

Addi - by registering on GA, you have already signed up for emails:D We launch mass emails very sparingly, so don't worry, we won't clutter your email inbox.

Rasmus Holmgren - bah, I can't promise you that:p

Rain - mine too:)

[nazeil]

Sounds pretty awesome. Will this sit strictly in environments (architecture/terrain/etc) or will it cross over into props and/or vehicles.

Actually i can probably answer part of that question just by thinking about it. if its a complete environment then it will certainly involve props and env models. heh. no sleep ftl.

[Razorb]

ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo! finaaaaally an enviro comp :D apart from the minicomp that is ! heh sounds fun and defo ace to see what people come up with :D:D if i got time ! i will defo join :>

gj fedh!

[funkdelic]

way too cool Fred, thanks for bring that :D

[otto]

Sweet. Looking forward to more details.

[Cybertron]

Awesome, looking forward to it :)

[Parnell]

There will be only one gameartisans.org main comp before this. It will start in a week or two.

Can't wait!
B

[Pacifica]

This sounds awsome and hopefully i'll have enough time to enter. I've only recently joined game artisans (although been a viewer for a while), and i was slightly worried there'd be no much interest in enviromental art, but since i've joined there's been an enviro mini comp, and now this huge event. Big thumbs up from me!

[FredH]

Pacifica - The plan is to make this comp so irresistible... that even character artists and animators join :D

[LowRez]

you arse fred!!! ive been waiting for a quality environment comp for ages, and now you plan one for the height of summer I live in england its only sunny in july and august damn it :P

[Ramseus]

Yay! Finally some enviro love! Characters get all the glamour :p

[Frozan]

yummmy im down.

[kongni]

Fred, you're "the man" :)

I REALLY hope the specs will accurately reflect industry standards. Otherwise, what's the point?

[onelung]

HA, enviro guys at work have been complaining that there is never a cool enviro challenge. Consider the word spread. Very cool Fred.

[iceblazer17]

this sounds really cool!

[akhenaten]

hey... when are we going to have the rules and guidelines

[YdoUwant2know]

For the love all things holy!!! Thank you Fred!! Looking forward to the details already. :thumb:

[Satya]

An environment challenge huh? this is quite interesting.... despite my lack of experience on the subject... hell yeah let's give it a try!

[clueme]

^_^ I want to join in.. but I'm terrouble busy..I must make a alpaha version game till august...
try..try..try..

[Ragnar]

Amazing news, looking forward to it!

[shepeiro]

sweeeet and excellent

[K_Sheriff]

This looks like a pretty damn good idea. I'm especially glad I've recently started working on much more environmental stuff.

[jpgourley]

Thanks for putting this one together Fred! =D I can't wait to hear the details on it.

[battags]

This sounds great! Many of my colleagues are excited to finally see a big contest for enviro art.

I would love to see a requirement for final renders/screenshots taken in-game!

[omnicypher]

i just got into environment modelling, so this should be some good practice. im wondering if it will be more fantasy oriented or more sci fi. also will it be a level, or just a render of the corner of a room? it would be hard to show off and compare entire levels without an overhead map and a flythrough video as some of the requirements.

[Aftermath]

Can you give us any feelers? I got 3 weeks off from school i would love to start planning some for this. Any word yet on poly counts and so on maybe like a range? I agree this comp should be to or around industry standards. But you guys have been doing fine with your poly counts and requirements in the past with whats within industry standards. Should be awesome!

[cookepuss]

I got 3 weeks off from school i would love to start planning some for this.
You and everybody else looking to win. :D Bet you were one of those kids who tried to see where your parents hid the Christmas gifts. :p

[Aftermath]

all i can say is santa and maalox dont mix well , cookies are booby traped Dr. Jones! :)~ Can you blame me?

[idegila]

sounds challenging! looking forward for this

[Wahlgren]

A competition where i can show off my awesome moves? Oh yes! :thumb:

[Jono-GHOSTWORKS]

YES!

I'm rusty and need more environment work anyways.... can't wait to get the details!

[ShaggyBeans]

This is exactly what I was looking for as I'm building my environment reel. Can't wait to get involved!:)

[Marbi]

Fantastic! :D

[zeke3d]

the main question I think most have is standardization, a hero building? with whatever you want for a sky and a simple ground plane, rolling hills and such. or a complete interior? hmmmmmmmm.

[Twindragon]

oooo I'm down for this competition. Now I just need to find someone to partner up with.

[ciprian0077]

How did you find(choose) your partener's?....

[Addi]

hi hi
*revives old thread*
Is the challenge still going to start on Friday? Just with the comicon pushed back a few days will that affect this?

thanks, cant wait :D

[blankslatejoe]

I believe it's been pushed back a couple of days yes. We wanted to secure a few more sponsors and such.

[sgv3dmax]

The start date was declared as August 29 2008. Is there any change to this? Please update.

[Bbox85]

Will anything at all be announced so people can start brainstorming over the weekend?

[cookepuss]

The start date was declared as August 29 2008. Is there any change to this? Please update.

The site was updated to reflect a new September 3rd start date. You're just going to have to wait a couple of more days before can get your grubby CG paws dirty.

[walrus]

... Or perhaps later. It's now the 4th across most of the world and no update. The Unearthly Challenge page seems to have replaced the on-the-second countdown timer with "Starting Soon." What's the latest E.T.A.?

[Vrav]

The suspense is killing me!

[lossenc]

I...must know! How soon is soon? Five minutes? Five days? I'm getting anxious! :brick:

[ThatDon]

The UC has officially gotten underway, check out the official rules and restrictions below!

http://www.gameartisans.org/forums/extras/uc1_forum.jpg (http://www.gameartisans.org/contests/events/4/rules/index.php)

[Per128]

Hola
Do we use this thread for questions about the rules?

[Per128]

Can we combine 2 concepts?
The reason I ask is some of them are quite sparse. Some show a hero piece but no environment, others the opposite.

Lightmaps:
-Can we use a second UV channel for these or do we need to duplicate geometry?
-What are the specs for the lightmap, 4096px?

What are the maps we are allowed to use? The specs don't specifically list the types or maximum number.

[Alexjh]

I've been looking forward to this for quite a while!
Hmmm... I must finish my mini comp entires first though.... curse this multitude of addictive competitions...

[Kwakkie]

Lets say you have a team of a concept artist and a 3d artist:
The concept artist can make concepts, but the 3d artist cant work out the concept art the concept artist made?

Pretty weird, or did I misunderstand?

[Jackablade]

Each artist can join one 3d team (or do 3d alone) and create one 2d entry, however, both entries must be completely different. Example, if you create a water bucket in your 2d entry, you better not have a similar bucket design in your 3d entry.That's what it says - No crossover between concept entries and 3d entries.

I suppose while I'm here I should take the time to talk some smack.
http://manolomen.com/images/Dark%20Helmet.jpg
"You see, Evil will always triumph because Good is dumb."

Props to Fred and the rest of the organisers.

[Vahl]

no Jackablade, in the case you quote it's one concept artist entering in 2d section, and a team (with your concept artist in it) entering 3d, like domwar3, you can't enter both with the same design, however, I don't see why within a team, some 3d artists couldn't play with the painting the concept artist will do from it, that's the whole point of a team, right, sharing ideas and discussing them to then execute them, a concept is just an idea pool and a global guideline anyways. so as long as your concept artist doesn't enter the 2d section with the concept you're using for the 3d section, everything should be fine.

Per : I'm pretty positive the lightmap is supposed to be on a second UV set

FredH : I think you forgot to include the size limit for the lightmap

[Kwakkie]

That's what it says - No crossover between concept entries and 3d entries.


So basically teams are only usefull if they only consist of 3d artist or only of concept artists... Not really what i imagined for this comp... guess my team is out:flag:

[SeveredSon]

4096x4096 total of texture space for each material pass
re: 4096x4096 total for diffuse, 4096x4096 total for normal maps, 4096x4096 total for specular, etc. etc.

Does this mean that the entire scene has to be on one 4096x4096 texture sheet for each pass i.e. diffuse, spec, normal, etc. ?or does this mean we can use as many textures as we want up tp 4096x4096?

[Arkadius]

SeveredSon: Thats what I'm wondering!

[blankslatejoe]

wait, severed, are you asking if you can split the total texture space up, right? like into 4x 2048s or something, right?

I think that's what the 'total' texture space refers to--it'd be tough to handle tiling and such if you tried to cram everything on a single 4096. Lets see what fred says

[Supernova87]

At last, it's arrived! Can't wait to start on something.

It's gonna be difficult but may even try for both 2d and 3d.

[brome]

Kwakkie - you can have a concept artist on your team. It's as simple as that. If he or the rest of your team feels like they're in shackles over the rules then you don't seem very creative :P So yes, again, 2 artists + concept artist is fine. You're MORE than encouraged to work off the concepts from your concept artist on your team.

vahl - lightmap is on its own texture and doesn't count towards the final textures you use. We forgot that part. The resolution we originally had was removed because its too difficult to get a resolution in lightmaps from a lot of engines out there as they make them, what seems to be, a bit random.

[SeveredSon]

blankslatejoe - Yeah that's what I was asking. If we can split up the 4096 map then that would be cool. If it all has to be on one sheet then I would rip my hair out....all of it.

[Bbox85]

Do cube maps count toward our total bitmap space. If i'm not mistaken, certain renderers can render reflections dynamically based on it's surroundings. Seems that anyone who wants to put thier environment in a Game engine would be at a disadvantage as far as reflections go. I don't really mind either way. Just wondering if they count toward the total bitmap space. Also, what are the rules on effects? Are they even allowed? OOoooo, I'm so excited for this!! *jumping up and down*

[seven]

If we choose good then we have to post a wip thread on gameartisans? Likewise, do we have to post on polycount if we choose evil or does it matter?

[FredH]

seven, if you choose good, yup, you would have to create a thread on GA. Unfortunately, as you know, threads can only be created by using the entry system. Since the entry system is still not open, you would need to wait 1-2 days before you can begin your entry and thread. If you join evil polycount, yes, you can go there now to create a thread.

Kwakkie -> Just want to add something to what brome said. Yes, you can have a concept artist or two on your team, but as a team, you must still pick a concept from the base 89 concepts found on the UC site. You can not create a concept from scrath for the 3d challenge.

Jackablade - Concept artists can join both categories.

Per128 - Nope, you can not combine two concepts.

[chrismaddox3d]

can your final render shot be in a game engine example ue3,
or does it have to be in a 3d render example 3ds max,

[mactaveous]

Can you be good but also evil at the same time :) So half of your enviroment is good but the other half is evil. Can you start a thread on both sites? :D

[Taehoon]

can your final render shot be in a game engine example ue3,
or does it have to be in a 3d render example 3ds max,

The rule says

rendering can be created within any 3D software application or Game Engine.


So I think we can choose either way.!

[chrismaddox3d]

The rule says

rendering can be created within any 3D software application or Game Engine.


So I think we can choose either way.!

ok thanks,
i should learn to read a little more carefully and not skip over things,lol

[Codeman]

What a shame, I now have to go to polycount as the good guys suck! ;)

I must say the rules are kind of weird and seemingly random. Oh well a challenge is a challenge.

[Addi]

question: - if we were to choose a concept with water in it... and we were going to render from Unreal3 or Crysis, can we make a water shader for that? I'm guessing we cant just use the prefab liquids in the editors but, can we make our own? that ok?

[zortech]

I have given some thoughts to the texture size. 4096² for the entire scene is already quite challenging, but the most of the concepts have a surrounding environment or a sky.

Creating a sharp and detailed cubemap plus a good looking environment...I don't think that's possible.

Those are the specs for ut3:
dome 2048²
cube 4096x1024

[YdoUwant2know]

Worth the wait!

[seven]

I'm sure many on Gameartisans would like to know what you would define as good or evil.

Does good mean a level from animal crossing where there is absolutely no chaos? Likewise, does evil mean a typical map from gears of war or diablo where destruction or an ominous presence is apparent? Where would the line be drawn?

[Emil Mujanovic]

Can you be good but also evil at the same time :) So half of your enviroment is good but the other half is evil. Can you start a thread on both sites? :D
I highly doubt you can enter both a good and evil entry. Once you pick your side, you can then make a 2D and/or 3D entry for that side only.

One of the Polycount members brought up a question regarding vehicles in our entry. There are quite a few vehicles in the concepts so I wouldn't mind a bit of clarification on them. Are we allowed to include vehicles in our final pieces? Not just broken down inanimate ones, but fully functioning (flying/hovering/driving/etc) and are they allowed to be focal points in our final entry or are they only allowed to be background objects?
Thanks, Fred.

-caseyjones

EDIT:
I'm sure many on Gameartisans would like to know what you would define as good or evil.
Here (http://www.gameartisans.org/contests/events/4/homepage/index.php) is a good run down of what is considered good and evil, just read under each forum image.

[seven]

EDIT:

Here (http://www.gameartisans.org/contests/events/4/homepage/index.php) is a good run down of what is considered good and evil, just read under each forum image.

I didn't see that, thanks.

[FredH]

mactaveous - LIke casey said, nope, you can't be both good and evil and create threads on both sides.

caseyjones -> Yes, vehicles are allowed and they can be turned on and moving, but it would probably be easier if they were off so that they don't take too much attention away from your environment.

chinese_lover -> You'd better read the rules carefully before starting. It would be terrible if you had to restart your entry just because you missed reading something.

Addi -> yes, that's fine:)

[pinoycliff]

question - I know it says no characters allowed. So would severed body parts be okay? And up to how severed do it have to be? Cause would a body without a head be considered a character or just a severed body part? And lets say someone makes a battlefield scene, would the wounded bodies be considered characters?

[Alexjh]

How open to interpretation are 'good' and 'evil'? Could I, say do the ruins of some civilisation with majestic buildings that would have ticked the boxes of the good side before they were ruined? Would the ruins still being a beautiful and peaceful environment still quality them as good?

[bloody]

good news ! :D

Thank you FredH, but i've a question about the rules : Mentalray is allowed for the rendering? If he's, it means that GL or FG is also authorized?

Thank you :)

[Supernova87]

I'd like to add to Alex's question and ask say if I were to have some kind of fantasy forest you could see from the outside and it's full of really amazing and beautiful colours as well as other details like architecture etc. but deep within you can see dark figures and mysterious prying eyes.

Would that be ok if I decided to go for "good"?

[Addi]

Thanks Fred, another question, regarding terrain like.. Unreal 3 BSP terrain. Would that be counted towards the tri count?

Also! Skulls as props, bones, severed legs and arms, are these counted as props or characters?

[FredH]

pinoycliff -> if you put in severed dead bodies, they would be considered low detailed statues, so they would be fine. We just don't want to see characters of any kind as the focal point of a scene as they tend to immediately grab the attention away from any surrounding environment.

Alexjh -> Yes, creating a ruined environment where a feeling of good still remains would be perfect for this comp. It would show that it's ever lasting. You could even surround your area with darkness, fire, or something chaotic to give your center calm piece even more impact. Something like the feeling one gets when he sees an Oasis in a desert.

bloody -> "Lighting and rendering can be created within any 3D software application or Game Engine."
As mentioned in the rules, all lighting and rendering packages are fine.

Supernova87 -> Yes, that would be perfect for this comp.

[kenjitsu]

I was just thinking, that environment artist often put a human in the pic just to define the sense of scale? No characters allowed, incl no humans right?

Thanks...

[Indignation]

Yeah I am pretty stoke about this as well. The prizes are sweet too ;) Cant wait to start but I kind of wish I had a team though. Been having trouble finding people work with me LOL.

[FredH]

kenjitsu -> Yes, it's no characters for this comp. As previously mentioned, low detailed dead bodies are fine, so if you really really need a character in your scene, this is always an option. Other than this, you would need to find another way to define a sense of scale. Perhaps a very familiar item that everyone knows, could do the trick?

Indignation -> Finding team members online is a bit tough.. especially if you are a new and unproven member. If you start your project, and do a quick and good job of starting it.. I am sure that if you later put in a request that you are looking for an additional team member or two, someone would be happy to jump in and give you a hand. Show a little conviction to your entry, and you will find another determined artist who would love to help:) Oh, by the way, you can always add team members later. You don't have to start as a team...

[Vig]

What about ambient critters like birds, bats, flies? They wouldn't be the focus of the scene but more like a flock flying through a valley or a few birds hanging out on a power pole/wire?

[seven]

What about ambient critters like birds, bats, flies? They wouldn't be the focus of the scene but more like a flock flying through a valley or a few birds hanging out on a power pole/wire?

sorry, off topic
is that a warmachine character in your avatar and if so, is it yours?

[Bbox85]

Hey Fred, what are the rules on Dynamic Lights?

[artist_cg]

i just wanted to say hi everybody , i am new here , and i saw the amount of energy and creativity , something challenging , i am into this challenge , good luck everybody

[Ramseus]

Yeehaw! Now who wants to let me join their team? Pretty please?

[FredH]

Vig - Small ambiant critters are fine:)

Bbox - Dynamic lights? Any Rendering and Lighting solution is fine:thumb:

[Prischool]

I was checkin out the prizes.. and boy.. that is a LOT of t-shirts! haha!

[otto]

Yeah man the winner has got laundry covered for a week. Maybe even a month. :P

EDIT: All joking aside, thanks for putting on another awesome competition! I am crossing my fingers to finish this one.

[kessler]

Hip Hop Hurray! This is going to be awesome.!!

[goffskullz]

This is a really great challenge, its something different in a world of character challenges.

I have a question about skyboxes/backgrounds, so we need to take 2 renders from different angles, so it of course has to be a section of environment that looks like it doesn't just end at the end of a road, but what about the backgrounds and skyboxes, do they only have to be in the area's that would be in the final 2 shots, or should they encompass the whole Scene?

I'm guessing that's what the rules mean when they say playable but I am interested in how we could actually show that we made it playable with only 2 shots.

[FredH]

Prischool -> Yeah, it's quite a bit. Two big boxes!
I got a few extra t-shirts... so like the winners, I am going to look sexy for a long while too:D

otto -> Glad you like the new event. Good luck:)

Goff -> Skyboxes are fine. They don't count towards your polygon or texture limit. As for modeled backgrounds, we leave it up to artists to figure out an interesting way to end their scenes. Since the center of focus is generally in the center, you can fade off the edges with untextured models, or blackness, or fog.. or fading buildings. Basically, the route you take to accomplish your endings.. we leave up to you:thumb:

[artist_cg]

is particles are allowed , using sprites , just for some smoke may be coming out of factory , thanks

[jamis]

Hi all

until wich point can we get away from the original chosen concept ? for exemple, can we replace an industrial old building by a gothic church with the same global volumes and shape ? can we change trees into rocks of the same size ?

[metalpiss]

holy shit, finally, I've been waiting for months in suspense :D
I'll be in for sure, I just hope I won't mess up like I did in dominance war and start my entry 2 days before the deadline...

[MoP]

Just to be sure: if I wanted to, I could render my scene in Mental Ray with all high-quality settings, radiosity, final gather, global illumination turned on?

And if I'm baking a lightmap for my scene, does the lightmap come out of my texture budget?

[kary]

Following up MoP's: What about glows? If you use another renderer, IE: max scanline, where you normally composite them after.

[-IdanI-]

thanks for putting another great challenge up and running. :thumb:

I got a question, what about having transparent spirits that will blend with the scene but wont exactly be the main focal point of the enviorment.

I would also like to know about the light maps as MOP stated. :think:

[Peris]

real men make realtime renders!

[DivideandRender]

Cant join yet. Will get started anyway. 250 k tris!

[devoid]

Just wanted to make sure Vertex Alpha and Vertex Color were both cool for this one?
Thanks for what looks to be another awesome contest.

[MoP]

I would assume vertex alpha and vertex colour would be allowed, since in most game engines today they're almost free (especially compared to normal maps, parallax, particle effects and all the other stuff we're allowed).
I'm kinda counting on it actually. I want vertex colour to be allowed, and can't think of any good reason why it shouldn't be! :)

[blankslatejoe]

you planning on mixing textures/UVsets via vertex color there, mop ? :)

[MoP]

Nah. I was mainly gonna use it for tinting stuff and getting more mileage out of tiling textures by breaking them up with vertex colours. Oh, and making water edges smoothly fade.
I might do some texture mixing on landscapes if it comes to that, might even use a small Megatexture though :)

[Aaronindhouse]

I have question about the the whole picking one of the concepts thing. When you pick one, do you use it as more of a setting or do you have to leave all of the major elements and composition alone. Like if you have a building in a wooded area could you add more? If you have a forest could you throw in a house? Basically i guess what i'm trying to ask is are restrictions lax? Like if i had a forest concept, as long as whatever i make is in a forest would that be ok?

[Aftermath]

yea vertex coloring would be good so we could do blends.

[nomijade00]

Hey Fred!

How much changing of a scene is too much? For example, lets say that there are a bunch of symbolic evil things in a scene but they are all changed to good symbolic things. Would that been too much like making a "front door" turn into a "back door"?

[Prischool]

FredH - Yea, well.. i don't see how one could NOT look pimp in a Valve shirt while holding a wacky alien doll. :p

[paprika]

can i make statues similar to this one, with this much detail, maybe a little bit more?thanks.

http://k41.pbase.com/o6/68/715868/1/70346846.kM1pnkwA.19760583.jpg

[Wedu]

still unable to register an entry :(

[artist_cg]

i have a question , can i take mix 2 concepts together , i like a concept as main , and i like a building design in another one , so can i mix , thanks for your patience :)

[WhiteGuardian]

Fredh, i'm still confuse with the meaning of Good and Evil. Can you describe the detail?
May we using magical effect/element? Cause i wanna try to make mixing of ice and fire element to the environment.

Thx a lot for the answer :)

[FredH]

artist_cg -> Yes, particles are allowed. If you use any custom effects, then is comes out of your texture and/or polygon budget.

jamis -> We leave it to you to decide what's too much or too little. The rules are very open, but they are pretty clear. Good Luck.

metalpiss -> Yes, let's hope not:p Better get started right now!

MoP -> "With any 3D software application or Game Engine" means all rendering and lighting solutions;) No, lightmaps do not come out of your texture budget.

-IdanI- -> The minute you put a character type thing in your scene, it will immediately grab attention. But I am sure you will figure out a way to balance everything so that the spirits just enhance what you are really trying to showcase... your environment. It's going to be a challenge. Good Luck:)

devoid -> Yup, it's fine.

[FredH]

Aaronindhouse -> If you had a forest, yes, you can add a house. Basically, if someone puts your final 3d realization beside your original concept, he should see some form or a resemblance. If you choose a very sketchy one, perhaps you are adding more definition to it so you keep the same layout and simply add lots and lots of details. Or, if you choose one of the more detailed ones, maybe you will change a few items in the scene, change the lighting, put in fire everywhere, and .... yes, anything is possible. I can't really explain this further. Good Luck. If you need suggestions and feedback on how your entry is progressing and whether you are on the right track or not, ask the community what they think:)

nomijade00 -> making a front door into a backdoor in the back of the building is like recreating the entire scene in a different locale. There are absolutely no similarities. Changing spirits from evil to good still keeps the same local and still keeps the very basic structure of the image, so yes, this is fine:)

Wedu -> Try now...
http://www.gameartisans.org/contests/events/join.html

artist_cg -> Rules say choose "one," not mix and match:p

WhiteGuardian -> Describe good and evil?:eek: I leave it up to you to do some research on this topic:doh: Mixing fire and ice in an image is fine:thumb:

[Garuda]

why i cant submit my entry with only one member ?

[FredH]

I am not sure what's stopping you from joining as one member? If you are pressing the Submit Finals button, please don't. That button is only there for when your entry is finished and you have uploaded all final images. To get your entry started, you only need to enter a teamname (if 3d), entry title, url address (if you are on polycount) and first wip thumbnail.

[Ksan]

Ok Fred, I have a question.

I have plans to enter the 2D catagory for GA (good) no matter what. I am really excited about it, and will not change that.

However, I have recently been summoned to help a 3D entry with concept. I know it is ok to have 1 entry per catagory(2D and 3D), but I am a bit iffy. This is because the 3D entry would be for Polycount (evil). Is that allowed? I don't want to cheat or be treacherous, someone bent on making a diabolical entry just wants to legally obtain my help.

Just want to know if it's kosher, thanks:approve:

[OneEyedJack]

So wait.. You have to choose a pre-made concept from this site and somehow use that in your final illustration? I'm not following. It can't be completely original?

Also they say you can make 3concepts. Does that include making for example:
1good( GA) and 2evil (Polycount) ? Or does it have to be 3good or 3evil?

[FredH]

Ksan - You can't really jump in on both teams, even if one is 3d and the other is 2d. How about if you try to convert your friend(s) to good?:D

Pawkfox - The concept rules say you must create an entry from scratch. So there is no using pre-made concepts for a base. All 3 concepts must be either Good or Evil.

[katzeimsack]

ok, we are allowed to have corpses, but

am i allowed to build a whole city out of them?

They wouldn't be a focal point, like a dead king on his throne, but more like bricks in walls..

[Ksan]

No I can't convert him, bummer....

[FredH]

katzeimsack, yeah, that's fine:)

Ksan, oh oh, that's a shame. It's never easy selling Goodness when someone is hell bent on being Evil:p Ok, so what's your plan?

[TksDeadly]

After reading all this thread, i understand most of it, but still one more thing i like to Ask, Most of the guys doing outdoor scenes, but there are indoor concepts too, so if we do indoor concept do we have to make all the four sides of the room or just 2 or 3 sides will be Okay?
And do all the Tirs in the scene counts or only which are avaible in the camera?

[MoP]

FredH: AdamBrome posted this over on polycount ... is it true, and if so, why?

Under no circumstances is the use of BSP allowed for this competition!

Why not? It becomes a triangulated mesh at compile time, and you can count the triangles of that mesh. You can also export the BSP-optimised mesh to a 3d package to get an exact triangle count (well, you can with ETQW's EditWorld anyway).

It's all triangles in the end, I see no reason why BSP should be disallowed as a starting point or filler for a scene.

Currently all my stuff is brushwork and patch work. I could export it all to models, but it would make no sense - the resulting mesh would be exactly the same number of triangles, with exactly the same amount of texture coordinates.

This sounds like a pointless restriction to me, unless there is a really good reason for it? I can't think of any.

[FredH]

MoP - I guess you heard, BSP is fine now but you have to get your poly count with your mesh switched to polies. Thanks for this question. I am sure it will help others too:)

TksDevil - All the tris count regardless of what's in or out of camera view and if you do an indoor scene, you can make it so that it is prepared exactly for your final two shots. So if you are never taking a pic of one corner of the room, don't waist your time modeling it:)

[MoP]

Yep. I can safely say that ETQW's EditWorld (which is basically an improved version of D3 and Q4 Radiant), has an "Export to model" feature which can run the whole map through the compile/optimise process in order to generate final correct triangle geometry, which you can then import into your favourite 3d app to check the triangle count.

I aim to make my environment a playable level too, so I'll probably just pull out the whole thing into Max for a fancy render. Hopefully I can get it looking great (and playable) in the game too :)

[Twindragon]

In a thread somewhere Fred mentioned that we can't use stock textures. Can we use stock textures but use overlays and other means to change them so they are different?

[Muchomuchacho]

Good times. I do declare those are some delicious slices of awesomeness.

[Aftermath]

To continue on Mop's question and awnser most engines now days allow export to obj i know sandbox,unrealed,cod4 all have it . It helps a ton, i use it to bake light maps for my walls and such.

This was originally pieced together in UnrealEd then brought back to max for final bakes. Some of the walls are BSP's that have been converted and cleaned up due to unreals crazy BSP cuts. It works really well for me.

http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n292/ICRYWHENIPOO/maxrender2.jpg

Hope this helps anyone who wants to use an engine, for me its easyier to navigate a bigger scene in the editors and build it piece by piece then go back to make to finish it up.

[Bbox85]

Ok, one final question from me. For our second Beauty Shot, are we constricted to only one view of our environment? I know for our first we choose the best view of our scene; however, I'm just wondering for the second beauty shot, if we can take several renders and fit them into the 1100x1100 area we're given. Sorta like DWII where we had multiple angles of our character for our Beauty.

[FredH]

Yup, you can put in multiple renders into your 2nd beauty shot.

[Jono-GHOSTWORKS]

for the 2D, I understand we can have no "inhabitants" in the scene, but for clarity of scale, can we place a silhouette or the like on the modeling sheet? IE: If I wanted to have a scene with truly epic doorways, could I place a 6ft tall man next to the detail on the mod sheet?

[freakmean16]

Yeahhh another great competition, ujuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu.

[zeus]

Phew right i've read this whole thread now and i think that there could still be some confusion over texturing. I emailed Fred asking whether 4096 was the space allowed per object in the scene or for the entire scene. Fred replied kindly by stating that 4096 was the space for the entire scene which seems like people are going to be fairly restricted with how many unique objects that need biggish amounts of UV space.

Im looking at some of the entries and there are some wild concepts that look great but to me seem like they'd need some hefty texture space to make them properly, so how is everyone getting around this, lots of tiled textures? I counted the amount of unique objects that id ideally love to unwrap in my concept art based scene (the ruined church one) and it'll be a squeeze onto that 4096 sheet (or equivalent broken up parts).

Also i read the post that Twindragon mentioned about no stock textures - im hoping that we can use cgtextures and then do the whole overlaying and colour fiddling process to make them appear as we want? If not how are u possibly going to tell whether people have photographed their own stuff or just got it off cgtextures? I really dont want to have to try and hand paint bricks etc lol

[FredH]

Yes, using stock textures are fine and overlapping images with images in ps is fine too:thumb:

I believe you are right about - how people will get around to texturing their scenes. They will use smaller tiling textures for wide spaces that are not really dominant in their scene (far background objects), and will use unique textures for the more important and up front objects and scenery. Getting the whole thing to fit in 4096 is a challenge in itself, so if needed, remember, you don't have to make an entire environment. If you model a room, you only need to texture the 3 walls that the camera will see;)

[Aftermath]

Hey Fred, my group is doing the throne room concept and i was wondering if you could do a castle style theme where a suit of armor is a decor piece? It will just be the armor hanging on the stand like you see collectors have them or midevil castles had armor stands with full suits for deco. Its technically not a character and will just be a prop i think its still legal to do it just would like to clarify before alot of work goes into it.

[FredH]

Yes, that would be fine:)

[zeus]

thanks for clearing that up Fred, i think unfortunately there are still a fair few teams that have overlooked the texture limits though - hope they catch on before its too late,ill try warning 'em

[Nuku]

I am one of those who overlooked the texture limits. I am fairly new to 3D modeling and texturing. I use DeepPaint3D and Photoshop to texture my models. I am unsure how to go about fitting all of my textures onto one sheet since they are all individual files. Could someone give me a heads up please? Is there some way to combine textured models and have them all export their textures to one 4096/4096 sheet? Like I said, I'm new.

[FredH]

You don't need to put everything on one sheet, you just need to have the total amount of texture sheets combined not exceed 4096x4096. So, if you have 4 seperate 2048 sheets, this would be fine since it takes 4 smaller 2048 sheets to make one 4096 sheet. You can make the sheets even smaller if you wish.

[Aftermath]

Fred i pmed you my issue but i think the system put me into the 2d comp heres why i think it wasnt my end. Whenever it can be resolved is fine, i wish to enter the 3d side of the comp. Thanks for all of the hard work the GA team does for these comps.

http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n292/ICRYWHENIPOO/Hmm.jpg

[FredH]

Ryan, it should be fixed now:)

[Aftermath]

Thanks Fred!

[David-J]

I have a doubt about the post process. I know that in the rules specify :

# Post-processing is allowed, but limited to:

* hue/saturation adjustment
* brightness/contrast adjustment
* depth of field
* bloom/hdr adjustment
* motion blur

But how about fog. I have seen some screenshots from guys who are doing it in the Game Engine. I am just starting to learn the Unreal Engine so we can't pull it off for this comp. I am using VRay and I can't get fog/mist out of it, only via scanline and then i would comp it in.

Would that be allowed? I know is post process but I was just wondering because I have seen some entries that are doing it straight out of the Game engine.

thanks

[FredH]

had to think about this one. Ok, adding the fog in ps is ok.

[ciprian0077]

Unearthly Challenge - 14 days Extension...Many artists are new to environment art so many mistakes have been made

Fred, it will be very instructive for us to know some of the mistakes (in generally)...I don't know if you have time for that but it should be very helpfull at the end of the contest if you made a thread with mistakes " it's not good because doesn't made..., doesn't start...etc."

Please help us the little one...!!!

Thank's for GameArtisans...I love it.

Regards,
Ciprian

[Rain]

Maybe it's referring to the scope some artists tried to undertake. Environment art is tough so if artists took on too much, a two week extension will give artists the needed time to really polish and finish their work. But, this is just my thoughts;)

[zeus]

Im not for the extension personally, i think deadlines are deadlines and that should be taken into account in the planning stages - it even puts those who have planned fully at a disadvantage as they may be add a near complete stage for the initial deadline and then have two weeks where theyre left wondering "do i add stuff and go against the initial plan but use the extra time, or do i stick with my plan, but have two weeks less than everyone else?"...

...saying that, were i behind then im sure i'd welcome the extension - i think my opinion my be biased based on personal circumstance lol

...

[BluPanda]

Is there ever a contest on here that doesn't get an extension?!

[blankslatejoe]

the minicomps!

[David-J]

I agree that the extension probably shouldn't have been given but now that it has it let's make the best out of it.

Usually on the opposite way but things like this also happen in real life. Your deadline changes and you need to adjust. Lucky for us it was for our benefit.

:D

Well, back to work and I am very excited about the entries I've seen so far. Really good stuff.

[Funky Bunnies]

This has been bothering me for a few weeks, but only a couple people have brought it up and it hasn't been answered yet. Probably nice to fix it with the deadline drawing near.

In the rules page your image sizes are restricted to 1100x1100 but the page where you upload it is restricted to 1000x1000.
so which is the right size?

[FredH]

You mean when you try to upload an image, it restricts it to 1000x1000? This has been fixed. You can upload 1100x1100 now:)

Did you find text somewhere that says 1000x1000? I couldn't find this.

[Funky Bunnies]

ah excellent, thanks Fred

It still says 1000x1000 on the 'edit entry's upload area - at least for the polycount team.

[FredH]

Oops, now I found it. Thanks for letting me know about this. It has been fixed:) If you encounter any other problems, be sure to let me know:thumb:

[WhiteGuardian]

Fredh, i have pm you about my statue in my entry. Have you read it? :)

[FredH]

Whiteguardian, yes yes, it's fine:)

[WhiteGuardian]

Thx fredh. :)

[zeus]

ITS OVER!!!!!!!!congrats to all who entered

[ZDCoe]

Just wondering if anyone has heard how soon the judging might be done?
Thanks!

[GSlash]

yeah ..really interesting question...i read it should be done for 3-4 weeks

[EricElwell]

What ever happened with this comp?

I really wanted to jump in, but I started my new job about the same time it kicked off. Haven't heard a thing about it since...

??

[Samahain]

I don't get it. Many entries weren't even finished!
They should be done any day now...

[ilegacy]

i also wait for new info :( but i think we can wait until 2009...