Unable to use PSD files as maps in 3DS Max (help!)

[walrus]

Hi, all. Up until recently I've been using 3DS Max 7 and Photoshop CS2 & CS3. They've always played very well together: It was easy for me to use a PSD file as a diffuse map, choose "Collapsed Layers," and see the map fine in Max. But now I am using 3DS Max 2009 and CS4. When I try to use a PSD in Max, layers with any transparency get all garbled - it's not WYSIWIG, and not really usable at all. I could just flatten the PSD and save it as a TIF, but doing that is a slower, less efficient workflow than what I used to do in earlier versions of Max. And I'm pretty sure Max is the culprit here: I tried usign a layered CS2 PSD and still had the same problem viewing is.

Anyone else have this problem, and/or know of a solution or workaround? Thanks!

-mike

[Deto]

Layered Tiffs work fine with newer versions of max. I'm not sure which, but I think it was max 9 since I was unable to use .psds too, but some people (school buddies) claim it works for them. I presume there's some crazy setting required.

But anyhow. I use tiffs myself. Layered tiffs can hold pretty much all the same data as .psd. Layer styles, transparency and so on. If you don't mind going for tiffs that is :)

edit: Oh and you don't have to collapse layers or anything for max. Just save the tiff file you're working on, go to max and hit reload unless it reloaded automatically (usually does)

[BigJohn]

That's interesting... I'm not sure what's causing that. I've been doing the exact same thing you're doing (plugging the psd into the diffuse, then saving in photoshop and alt+tabbing back and forth to see the results) forever now and it works fine. I'm using max2009 with cs4, but I've used it with cs3 as well, and all sorts of versions in the past and never had problems.

Maybe you could post the max file and psd files somewhere and we can look at it?

But it should work at any case.

[YdoUwant2know]

Yeah I've had that issue before. To get around it, I use the "save for web" feature (ctrl+shift+alt+s) in photo shop and save it out as a .png. It's a bit faster than the regular save as, and you don't have to worry about not saving your psd by mistake.

[blankslatejoe]

hm...all the 'saving as' thing is a hassle when you just want a quick preview...and actually max will update live in the background so long as you have it on the bitmap tab of the material. (where youd normally hit the reload button...the active reload is probably a bug, but it's handy!)

Are you trying to use transparency or normalmaps, Walrus? Those might make things a bit weird. It does sound like a maxbug to me... are your graphics card drivers up to date? Also, has it EVER worked with max 2009? I've only used 2008 and it works there...

[YdoUwant2know]

You are right, regular "save as" is a pain, but using "safe for web" is not really that bad. Once you get it set up the first time, you just need to start it up and hit enter 2-3 times and you are done. No constantly going through the menu options re-selecting the file type, clicking o.k. to overwrite or getting rid of the "copy" Photoshop loves to throw in. Just push "Ctrl+Shift+Alt+S" and hit Enter till it's done (quick note, the "enter" key on the number pad does not work for this). The only other thing you have to do, is set up Max to read your .png or .jpg instead of your .psd.

True, it's not as fast as just hitting "Ctrl+S" but still not to bad. Once you get the hang of it, it does not take more that a second longer.

[Deto]

I don't know why people wouldn't use tiffs as they work just fine. What's there in .psdees that can't be saved with .tiffs?

[blankslatejoe]

you just made me learn something new, deto!

I did a google search for tiff vs psd and found this link:
http://www.luminous-landscape.com/forum/lofiversion/index.php/t17170.html



Everything that can be saved in a PSD can also be save in a layered Tiff-6.0 file format...everything, paths, channels, layers, transparency, layer effects...there is nothing that PSD has "special" any longer and when that happened, Bruce and several engineers and I realized that the end of the Photoshop native file format had arrived.

Tiff has better compression (zipped tifs), can save everything that a PSD can save and be as large as 4 gigs in size (I think PSD is still limited to 2 gigs). Tiff is publicly documented where PSD requires a special NDA to access the internals. As a result, tiff is a more "archival" format while losing nothing by being used.


I might be making the switch....!

[Deto]

Cheers! One soul converted to my evil plan! :D

[walrus]

Huh, that's really interesting! I did try a layered TIF after your messages yesterday and it worked fine: Max 2009 had no trouble reading it. I know it's not too difficult to Save For Web, but it still is more work than just a normal Save... Not much, but annoying when Save alone used to work just fine (or still does for some of your school buddies.) Plus then you have one more file hanging around than you need. I'm just looking for the simplest, most elegant solution. Once PSDs don't work, saving as TIFS sounds like a good workaround.

Oh, an as for the files, no normal maps and to transparency... or, I should say, once you take all the layers collapsed together, no transparency. Individual layers had trasparency, and those are the ones that showed up on Max as garbles - like weird moire and noise patterns in all of the places that there were just alone solid color in the PSD.

But anyhow, thanks for the ideas so far!

[LowRez]

Hey Walrus, At work I use a script that saves my PSD and at the same time saves out as a TGA witht he same name, this all happens at the press of F12, it means you can get instant full updates in max at the press of a button without having to save each file then click save as... my only problem is that this is an old CS2 script, and I haven't yet tried it with CS4. I'll have a play if I get the chance and see if it works straight up, if not though Im going to have to ask the guy who wrote it about it.

[Draxxuss]

You don't quite need a script to do it.. just create an action and it will all be done for you with the click of a button.

[Aftermath]

Yea like Draxxuss stated above all you need to do is record the actions you've made then re apply it to a single layer of your choice or to a large batch.

[walrus]

Of course I could make an action. But all of that feels a bit to me like treating the symptoms but not the disease, as the saying goes. Sure, it's a work-around, but I'd also really like to know why Max and Photoshop won't play well together when they used to and they seem to for others. (But if no one knows then I may have to satisfy myself with workarounds like the above, so thanks!)

[seven]

Is there anything special about the file its self... I know when photoshop went to cs1 they put in the folder structure where you were able to place folders inside of folders... if you were in photoshop 7 and tried to open a cs1 file with that layer convention you wouldn't be able to open the actual file... instead you got random results. Is there something inside the file that is exclusive to cs4 that might be doing something similar inside of max? Have you tried saving out a fresh cs4 file without anything to see if that works?

[LowRez]

You don't quite need a script to do it.. just create an action and it will all be done for you with the click of a button.


I may be wrong, but doesnt an action like that just, mimick you pressing the save button, then the save as button, which will bring up the save as dialog box. The main reason I don't think it works the same is because the action doesnt record the buttons pressed while your in the save dialog, or force the tga to have the exact name as the psd.

The script does everything in the press of a button, it saves the psd, and saves out as a tga with an alpha, into the folder of the file. without opening any boxes or you having to click ok etc.. literally 1 button press when the script is set up as an action itself.

In fact If I recall the reason the script was even written was to actually make it work at the press of a button because an action in PS won't do exactly what we wanted..

unfortunatly the script is actually company property as I've just found out when asking about it and I can't post it up but looking at it, it's a fairly straightforward script to write yourself with a little PS scripting knowledge..

[Wynn]

have you tried changing you video driver settings in 3ds Max? Sometimes when I install Max it defaults to using software device and I have to change it to direct3D.. sometimes that fixes weird display anomalies... although that might not be the problem since you can see TIFF's just fine; although I am using psd files and they seem to be working right for me.

[walrus]

I thought you might be onto something there, or at least I had high hopes... But it turns out I am using Direct3D. I updated all my drivers - there's a new one less than a month old for my card... but that didn't help either. Nice try though! :)

[seven]

if you hit render do you get the same result or is it just in the viewport

[Wynn]

rats I was hoping that was it..

hmm must think some more.


lol, i tried googling this sort of thing and this thread came up as a result.. :P

maybe post a screenshot of what you are seeing?

[walrus]

Ha! In the end, Segreto, you DID help me figure it out. I was going to post a screenshot, but I needed to come up with all new art (NDA stuff, you understand.) And my new test file worked perfectly. So in comparing the two files, I figured out the difference, and thus the problem.

The moral of the story?
Hey kids, make sure your PSD files are 8 bits/channel instead of 16 bits and Max will be able to read them with no problem.

Mystery solved. (Thanks, everyone, for the help!)

[Wynn]

ah ha, prize for me!

glad you got it working Walrus, having to keep the .psd file at 8 bits is good to know. Kind of strange it has problems with 16 bit though..