Don Domingo Garcia

[theboldboy]

Hi everyone, just joined looks like a great site there are some very heavy hitters here thats for sure, thought I would post this up to let you see I have just finished it. He is one of the Boss characters from game called Crackdown for the xbox 360 it was quite a low poly ingame mesh brought into zbrush 3 and given some love, zbrush is truly an amazing piece of software.

Cheers, let me know what you think.

[MM]

hi, you have a good start here.
i think the eye socket could be pushed back a little and the ears could be little bigger. the jaw also feel a little narrow at the moment and the cheek bone should be a little bit lower i think. he also has a little bit bigger chin

[cookepuss]

I agree about the ears. They should be matching the brow/nose boundaries. They're coming up a little short.

As far as the chin is concerned, there's nothing particularly wrong with the width from the 3/4 view. It's the front ortho that reveals it to be fairly out of line with the jawline, creating a slightly odd underlying skull. I think that widening it might be a sensible idea, as well as pulling it out just a little. Right now, that skull is wedging a bit. More over, I'd probably pull down the cheekbones just a bit too. Not much, but enough where it'll happily emphasize the wear to his face.

EDIT>> :p Just noticed that you mentioned the cheekbones too. :) Oops.

EDIT 2>> One other thing. I think that you could probably tweak the lips a bit more. Maybe it's just me, but the upper lip is practically nonexistent. It's one thing to be covered by the stache, but there's not much of an indication of a lip line. Plus, the mustache seems to flow a bit too far over where you'd normally place your poly loops for the mouth corners. (Trying to visualize that myself.) It looks like the hair would nearly be roaming into the mouth at those corners.


Very good work on the whole. Glad to see I'm not the only high poly freak here. :)

[toma_li]

hello's and welcome to g a. i was just wondering what the tri count on the crackdown models was (roughly and only if your at liberty to say :) )

[theboldboy]

Thanks for the comments guys, Mashru and cookepuss I take on board everything you guy's say but he actually is exactly the way I want him to be.
The characters in Crackdown all had a stylised look to them so their proportions were a bit off the wall this guy was not so exagerated as some of the others so it might not be so apparent here, but valid comments from everyone none the less.
Cheers.

toma_li, thanks for your question on poly counts but I am not really able to give that info out but thanks for taking an interest and good luck with your studies.

[cookepuss]

Thanks for the comments guys, Mashru and cookepuss I take on board everything you guy's say but he actually is exactly the way I want him to be.
Fair enough. I can understand that all too well since my current project involves stylized forms, even wonkier looking than the Crackdown lot. There are many cases where style has to win out out over form. Nothing necessarily wrong with that as long as you're prepared to defend that position.

(Take Zelda Wind Waker as an example. That's a perfect example of style winning out over form - a decision that was routinely attacked/defended.)

From a style perspective, nothing particularly wrong with the your character anyway. The modeling is clean. The sculpting shows a high degree of skill. It's pleasant to look at. Seems like a winner to me.

[Johny]

most of the times people say that it is stylized to hide the fact that they cant make anything more or less real , i dont know if that is the case , but most of the times is like that.

i like the sculpt, but could be improved alot, even stylized it should show knowledge of bone structure, wich it doesnt .

[cookepuss]

Well, I'm inclined to agree with you that even stylized character follow basic anatomical rules, distorted though they may be. I'm also inclined to agree that the underlying anatomy here is a bit faulty.

However, I do not believe that he is attempting to cover up inadequacies in his knowledge by calling it stylized. Sometimes, you can just look at something for so long that you overlook what might otherwise be obvious inconsistencies. It happens all of the time.

[theboldboy]

most of the times people say that it is stylized to hide the fact that they cant make anything more or less real , i dont know if that is the case , but most of the times is like that.

i like the sculpt, but could be improved alot, even stylized it should show knowledge of bone structure, wich it doesnt .

Hi Johny, I would like to start by saying I find your comments quite offensive if you want to critisize my WORK then go ahead after all thats why people post their work to get crits, in this case constructive would be good but hey to much to ask it seems after checking up on your other posts.

I can assure you that when I say its stylized thats what I mean I don't have any interest in making anything that is "more or less real" thats not why I am in this industry.

If you care to check out the small gallery i have over at deviant you will see that there is nothing very "more or less real" there, I guess thats like saying if I show you mine then you show me yours I would love to have a look at some of your work.

I almost feel that you are accusing me of fraud? i have been a member of a few sites for some year's now and have posted quite a few times but I must say I have never ever recived a reply like this before.

If you want to share with me your knowledge of bone stucture go ahead but don't ever acuse me of being a phoney.

[Johny]

ezquizophrenia apart all i pointed was that usually when people fail at making something real ( because your model shows attempt at clear realism ) they give the excuse it is stylized, what they fail to also know is that cartoonists and animators need to know the traditional before attempting stylization .

And i said i didnt know if this was the case, but by your explosive reaction ill rest my case :)

You say that my posts arent constructive ? why ? because i dont sugar coat what is swrong ? because i point usually what looks off ? ok, let me start to say that you will have some trouble finding a way in the industry reacting like a bitch.

CRITIC : the cheeckbone even for stylized looks weird and blobby , the part of the jaw that connects to the skull the mandible looks also weird and pointy. i would post an image of a skull here but it isnt worth the trouble.

good luck mr perfect !

Edit : your deviant art concepts are awesome.

[Chasarsis]

Take it easy theboldboy, I don't think Johny was trying to offend, he was just being bluntly honest. And I agree with him. You're taking the model towards realism, but its not there yet because of a lot of little things about the proportions, and the sculpting.
What he said is true about me too; its not a reason for me to get offended, just to practice more.
This is especially true If this is the same Johny over on Polycount and cgtalk, he knows this stuff, and is pointing out a problem to as a more experienced artist so that others can improve.

[theboldboy]

"let me start to say that you will have some trouble finding a way in the industry reacting like a bitch."

Don't need any help finding my way been in it for 11 years and I have been a profesional artist for the last 30, if you did'nt mean your comment the way it sounded then fine.I reacted the way I did because I could'nt see anything constuctive about your post at all and correct me if I'm wrong but I thought thats what these sites were all about.

[cookepuss]

Guys. Please. There is absolutely no need to derail this thread. You have a good piece of work going. Please focus on that. The obvious, less desirable alternative is that FredH or poop will close this thread. This is the LAST thing you guys want.

For the sake of your respective sanities, let's remain focused and stay away from the name calling and flaming. This is a community. Let's act like one.

[LowRez]

hmmm bit of uproar for a second there. I think Style is fine, you know where your going more than anyone... so good stuff I love big ass mexican mostaches if I could grow one without a patch of ginger I probably would :P.

Johny, I get your points, but you put them so bluntly that it was only ever going to offend anyone but an iceman who doesnt care what you think anyways. Critisim should be creative wading in with opinions like " most of the times people say that it is stylized to hide the fact that they cant make anything more or less real"

It Is a bold comment when talking about art. Even if you didnt mean it you've basically said "you cant model and are trying to cover up" Its so undiplomatic I almost cringed when I read it, Its a sharp backhanded dig rather than criticism, being blunt doesn't make you many friends... and when a few seconds to think about what your typing would have saved you a lot of grief and not offended theboldboy, this is a small growing community of talented artists most working in industry already... Anyways your entitled to your opinion but "crit" like that won't win many friends (especially in a forum where you can't express what your saying with body language etc)

[Antimagic]

I am surprised oldboldboy kept his cool as much as he did after not one, but two harsh comments. Good stuff oldboldboy:)

About your model, yup, jaw could use some attention but other than that, I love it. If the rest of your work is this good, I can't wait to see it:) Hope you will keep posting, regardless of what happened here today.

[JesseMoody]

oh play nice ladies. johny is a bit harsh and you will have to excuse him but he is right. Not saying you were doing this as a cop out but some people do tend to say "oh this is stylized" when in actualality they were trying for realism but couldn't achieve it. Don't take it so personally.

Ok is the pissing match over yet? I played crackdown like a crazy person and loved the game. Would really like to see some more work from it personally.

[MM]

i will have to agree with johny here and i dont think his comments were offensive at all. it was just straight forward without any sugar coating.

it seems a bit contradictory when you post your work here asking people what they think and then after we take the time to post crits you go ahead and say "he actually is exactly the way I want him to be".

btw, i find it hard to understand how you get offended so easily from a critic in a forum specially being in the business for 11 years and all that.

you say it is stylized but you still have all the facial features in the head. the features are just out of place a bit. so if you want it to be stylized then my suggestion is to exaggerate those feature but keeping the realistic relative proportions intact.

[FredH]

I think the boldboy knows what needs tweaking at this point. If no one has anything new to add, then please don't say anything. No more refering to the previous comments please.


Boldboy, simply put, I like it:thumb: There are a few issues that were already mentioned, but overall, it's really good man. As you mentioned, this piece is already finished for being incorporated into a game, so then, I look forward to seeing what you come up with next:)

I guess you had a shaky start here, but welcome to GA:)

[cookepuss]

As you mentioned, this piece is already finished for being incorporated into a game, so then, I look forward to seeing what you come up with next:)
Yeah. Stylization is a very tricky, very subjective thing. As long as the model supports its overall context and does so without looking out of place then your job is done. Sonic fits in his world just fine. Stick his design in God of War and you've got lots to crit. It's all about context.

I stick with my original POV. I like it, but what matters most is that you're satisfied with the end result. You are so that's great.

I'm personally a lot more interested in seeing where you take the detailing on the rest of his model. He has the potential to be pretty bad@$$.


Slightly OT, but still related>>> Have you seen this video (http://www.animalada.com/videos/skeletoons.htm) yet? Animalada did this cool little piece about classic cartoon characters and their skeletons. Makes you really think about conventions that cartoonists take for granted.